my pet theory

topic posted Sun, September 28, 2008 - 1:06 AM by  Toby
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I wonder if an emotion or feeling has physical
Reactions, if one suppresses or stops the reactions,
Will thenfeeling go away. Say you're an Internet blogger who
Seeks attention. If you stop looking to see if
You have comments all the time, will your neediness
Go away?
posted by:
Toby
Seattle
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  • Re: my pet theory

    Sun, September 28, 2008 - 11:17 AM
    I'd say that for whatever reason there' s a desire, a need to release a specific flavor of energy. As long as the underlying cause remains intact - when a specific type of expression is halted, another avenue for the release (maybe on the surface appearing different) will immediately appear.
    • Re: my pet theory

      Sun, September 28, 2008 - 3:48 PM
      "flavor of energy"??
      • Re: my pet theory

        Mon, September 29, 2008 - 2:21 AM
        Any expression has a variety of components that are unique for it at that moment, a signature, a spectral pattern, a unique color so to speak. I made it up. Your response, "flavor of energy"??, well, that was the color of your response.
  • Re: my pet theory

    Sun, September 28, 2008 - 5:06 PM
    toby, in a strong sense what you are describing can be seen in anatomical terms correlating to the experiences of emotion, though, and self-regulation. what we call "emotions" are usually signals radiating from areas of the limbic system, such as the amygdala, and attempts to translate these signals into appropriate behavioral responses are performed generally in the pre-frontal cortex. if we look at the anatomy, and the pathways of these signals, we see that our ability to manage "emotional" signals is very restricted. as charles writes, the tighter the grip, more often the squigglier the signals become to make themselves known. repression is an important evolved function, but it can be overdone a great deal!
    • Re: my pet theory

      Sun, September 28, 2008 - 8:28 PM
      Repression may be one somatic strategy, but I'm not necessarily talking about that. If I was angry and didn't express myself outwardly that might verge on repression. I wonder about feeling angry, acknowledging it, yet not outwardly expressing it.

      I'm interested in something like, somebody feels tense so they scrunch up their shoulder. They realize this and unscrunch their shoulder and internally feel better. Is it a correlation or conditioning or a self perpetuating feedback loop?

      I had the analogy in mind of a crystal, when pressure is applied, creates an electrical signal. And the converse. Of course the pressure on the crystal doesn't go away, but if you remove the crystal from the circuit the circuit is 'open', no current.
      • Re: my pet theory

        Mon, September 29, 2008 - 5:47 AM
        Ah, a good, concrete example... ("unscrunching", that is - and more useful for illustrating the question than a - ahem - *colourful* metaphor which doesn't point to any neurophysiological reality.) I think it's more than a correlation - probably a minor feedback loop, at least.

        Another example that has occurred to me before is making a fist/shaking a fist when one is angry - I think this tends to reinforce and amplify the emotion, and refraining from making the fist (while still acknowledging the anger) may prevent that feedback.

        The crystal metaphor is illustratively useful, but also potentially misleading, not just because parallels are never exact, but because of the difference in complexity between biological and non-biological systems. Even a useful metaphor is always a double-edged sword (another metaphor, of course!) that could point away from reality as easily as towards it.
        • Re: my pet theory

          Mon, September 29, 2008 - 5:55 PM
          With respect to how our neurophysiology is processed and integrated, it is all (other than chemical signaling) coordinated and synthesized into muscular responses that are exemplified by our actions, and this includes speech and its inflection and intonation. And certainly this meshes with your fist-making example. To a greater degree it's the changing repertoire of muscular contraction and relaxation that dictates our responses to the world. And, yes, I agree with you - in that it's controlled by an ever changing feedback loop.

          Even if one has been trained/programmed to not make the fist, the internal state that has been created, the energy behind the desire, if left unchecked, will ultimately find a vehicle for its release.
          • Re: my pet theory

            Sun, October 26, 2008 - 3:15 PM
            it's important to recognize that the nervous system is a parallel system that produces serial behavior. the notion of a perfect synchronization among all systems is mythic. that's one reason to roll your eyes when the gurus promise an everlasting peace at the end of the tunnel, where all you do is sit under trees and shit sunshine.
            • Re: my pet theory

              Mon, October 27, 2008 - 1:00 AM
              "...the nervous system is a parallel system that produces serial behavior. the notion of a perfect synchronization among all systems is mythic."

              Defining a response as being serial is perceptual artifact defined by the limitations of human perception and interpretation.

              I think it has to do with how a behavior or a set of behaviors is characterized. Our perception of a particular signal, one we've been looking for, maybe even expecting, might be perceived as being a serial phenomenon, yet such an analysis is a gross simplification of the underlying process. The perceived response is serial because that's how we've been constructed to evaluate responses based on the granular limitations of perception. Yet, I'd say that the underlying process is more accurately described as multidimensional parallelism, a continuum whose influences upon elemental forces are synchronized with respect to the contiguous fields (or particle interactions) in which it happens to be immersed.
              • Re: my pet theory

                Thu, October 30, 2008 - 11:06 PM
                maybe we should consider parallel processes funneled into different fewer parallel processes then? surely if consider the scope of neuronal pathways vs. the options of embodied enactments we see, there's something to be said along the lines of a pruning.
                • Re: my pet theory

                  Fri, October 31, 2008 - 1:18 AM
                  "maybe we should consider parallel processes funneled into different fewer parallel processes then?"

                  Not that I want to throw numbers around, but consider what's going on in our nervous system, which consists of 100 billion neurons and over 500 trillion synaptic connections, not to mention god knows how many molecules and more atoms and even more subatomic particles - and this is just for starters. The cores of the smallest of these elements transition into waves that appear to possibly extend to the limits of our known universe. Parallelism extents far beyond our apparent serial decision making capabilities we *appear* to unceasingly utilize to get us from point A to point B. Our awareness is a minuscule subset of operations that has evolved specifically to keep us alive until our genes have had the opportunity to propagate themselves, to keep their container functioning until that time when the process has been completed. It's really no more than a story we make up as we go along. And as we're discussed elsewhere, we *may* not even be responsible for making up the story in the first place.

                  Seemingly, the majority of the required information and functionality for our physical persistence is in place by the time the containers emerge from their hosts, and of course, in our specie, a certain amount has to be passed on from the big containers to the little ones, yet this is a relatively new feature from a geological perspective, though apparently required by our high end, super-charged, state-of-the-art models.

                  Massive parallelism not only exists within us but within the seamless connection to our environment, and again, we're aware of only a tiny tiny fraction of the complexity; it's simply beyond our level of comprehension because comprehending it is not a requirement - we'll get along just fine without the electric windows. And because our capabilities of being actively aware are so extraordinary limited with respect to what is actually going on in a global sense, we end up calling what we are aware of as being serial. It's simply a way of making a distinction. It's the best we can do, though merely a stab at a comparison, neither of whose elements we're capable of fathoming. Both the definitions and the comparison are figurative really, sort of like comparing a raindrop to the Pacific Ocean.
      • Re: my pet theory

        Thu, October 15, 2009 - 5:15 PM
        Interesting question .

        (Like the fact that you brought up crystals ---crystallography has fascinated me for years) .

        The speculation that you have mentioned leads to another question .

        Could there be a way of by dint of retrospection revivivfying old emotional responses that one no longer feels any more . ?
  • Re: my pet theory

    Sun, October 26, 2008 - 3:21 PM
    toby, you might consider checking out the work in psychology under the rubric "self-regulation" for further details on the subject. also, any works specifically on the pre-frontal cortex (perhaps specifically the orbitofrontal cortex) might be telling, as this is where that "suppression" or "stopping of reactions" comes from. not sure how deep you want to investigate, but that's the direction to go in if you want the study to yield a lot of fruit. there's a book called "does consciousness cause behavior?" that is also excellent. look under the heading "executive functions" as well.

    i think you will find that the little voice in your brain that thinks it's in control and can stop the train of reactions might have a little bit of a grandiose opinion of itself!

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